Forum Topic

Brentford, Ballymore and Hounslow Council

Am I the only one who wonders how the members of the Steering Committee could ignore the objections of Brentford citizens and community organizations in approving Ballymore's plans for Brentford? I look toward our elected public servants as people who seek office to serve those who have placed them in positions of trust, not seeking those positions for personal gain! Let's vote them out of office the very next time they are up for re-election, and let's sent all the members of the Hounslow council the message that they are there to serve us, not the other way around.

Jeff Birnberg ● 4064d19 Comments

Also worth pointing out that Lionel Road is but a short walk from a station which is not only a tube but also an Overground station and served by more buses than GP. It is also a lot more accessible to the M4.I'm sure Raymond would have been delighted if BFC had relocated to somewhere with even better transport links - Milton Keynes perhaps?

Guy Lambert ● 4043d

'Brentford Station is less than 3 minutes from the ground' - are you some kind of speedwalker?

Anne England ● 4043d

Re: Raymond HavelockRH: "Of course the Brentford FC application was manipulated. It was quite blatant and that was the point Anthony was making. How easy it is to do.At every game prior to the application vote, fans were urged to support the application. So were members and ticket holders. I still have some of the communications as a lifelong fan.In the event far less acted in support than even I would have expected. It was also revealed that most who did respond do not reside locally."RC: You must have a different understanding of "manipulated" to me. What you have described above is nothing more than a club mobilising its supporters to back its application. As such, the application was transparent, straightforward and entirely open to scrutiny by LBH and challenge by opponents of the scheme.RH: "The total lack of realistic access by one of the most log jammed road networks in London with no solutions on the board will make getting to a game for both home and away fans truly awful. The big push centring on Kew Bridge station is a white elephant. Even now, with far from ideal facilities, Brentford station is less than 3 mins from the ground yet is underused even though it is really convenient. As are excellent links from 3 tube stations and 6 bus routes.A luxury housing development encapsulating the ground withno adequate parking even for coaches. It will be just the same maybe even worse.How long will it be before these well heeled luxury residents take umbrage at a multi use stadia and take action to curb all activities outside of matchdays?It will be back to square one."RC: All of the above was addressed exhaustively in the process of seeking/granting Planning Permission. And BFC are already coping with greatly increased crowds of 10k+ at GP (a mile away from LR) and the world hasn't come to an end.RH: "Quite a few are really unhappy about it.  I have very mixed feelings.For some it's all about Griffin Park. For others, me included, it's about the rose tinted utopia of a new stadia which will simply be a 21st century repeat of the same circumstances that now make Griffin Park untenable in the eyes of the club.Brentford fans are not stupid, they can see past the chaff and know it's flawed. They know a new stadium in Brentford is just what they want but are not sold on it being the Holy Grail."RC: You're right about one thing, Brentford fans are not stupid.  Hence they know that staying at GP and losing £500k p.a. was entirely unsustainable. Therefore a new stadium is absolutely essential if the club is going to survive on a full-time basis in the Football League.And the club having searched the Borough extensively for a suitable site for over a decade, the fans accept that Lionel Road is not just the best option for a new Stadium, it is the ONLY one.Therefore LBH having been persuaded that the finances and logistics etc of Lionel Road stand up, it is now up to the club, its owners, staff, players and supporters to make the most of the opportunities which LR offers to revitalise the club and move it to the next level for decades to come.And if you really are a terrace regular, you will know that the process is bang on schedule in just about every respect.COYB!

Richard Cathcart ● 4043d

Of course the Brentford FC application was manipulated. It was quite blatant and that was the point Anthony was making. How easy it is to do.At every game prior to the application vote, fans were urged to support the application. So were members and ticket holders. I still have some of the communications as a lifelong fan. In the event far less acted in support than even I would have expected. It was also revealed that most who did respond do not reside locally.All the people I stand and watch with are far from happy about moving. Quite a few are really unhappy about it.  I have very mixed feelings. For some it's all about Griffin Park. For others, me included, it's about the rose tinted utopia of a new stadia which will simply be a 21st century repeat of the same circumstances that now make Griffin Park untenable in the eyes of the club.The total lack of realistic access by one of the most log jammed road networks in London with no solutions on the board will make getting to a game for both home and away fans truly awful. The big push centring on Kew Bridge station is a white elephant. Even now, with far from ideal facilities, Brentford station is less than 3 mins from the ground yet is underused even though it is really convenient. As are excellent links from 3 tube stations and 6 bus routes.A luxury housing development encapsulating the ground withno adequate parking even for coaches. It will be just the same maybe even worse.How long will it be before these well heeled luxury residents take umbrage at a multi use stadia and take action to curb all activities outside of matchdays?It will be back to square one.No one behind the scheme has answered these questions. And they have been asked since the first exhibition.Brentford fans are not stupid, they can see past the chaff and know it's flawed. They know a new stadium in Brentford is just what they want but are not sold on it being the Holy Grail.

Raymond Havelock ● 4044d

Ref: Alex Shpinkov,I have no wish to clog up this thread by re-opening another issue entirely (and one which has already been settled, for better or worse).Rather, I was merely taking issue with Mr. Waller's claims that the BFC Application was "manipulated" and that the vast majority of Bees fans are not supportive of the club's move to Lionel Road.Such claims are risible, and demonstrably so.

Richard Cathcart ● 4045d

Richard, it is quite clear that a lot of BFC fans want a new home for the club. For a number of reasons. Unfortunately, the fans (and unfortunately the club) often do not give enough consideration to the needs of people who live in the area. Your response above completely ignores the issues associated with the new grounds – such as lack of infrastructure, excessive size and capacity of the proposed buildings, etc. Of course the need to have a new fancy stadium for the future Premier League events is important, but why should this be at the expense of the local people and those who use infrastructure?

Alex Shpinkov ● 4046d

Re Anthony Waller:"The Brentford FC application was manipulated, and even amongst fans there is a degree of consternation about what was said and implied in their name. A great many fans are unhappy about moving at all and a great many split about the 'benefits' of the new venue given it's lack of improved infrastructure around the stadium."Can't speak on the Ballymore/BHS debate, but as a long-standing Bees fan, who was peripherally involved in the club's campaign to move to Lionel Road, I can confidently assert that your statement above is absolute nonsense - esp the second sentence.Whilst regretting that the club has no option but to leave Griffin Park (fond memories and all that), the vast majority of Bees fans are looking forward to moving into the club's new home.If nothing else, we're going to need it for when we're in the Premier League!

Richard Cathcart ● 4046d

I do not know a soul who is for the development as proposed. Like many locals in conversation over the last few weeks, there is concern as to just who would be bothered writing in support in such numbers.The tell tale is the public meetings. If people feel strongly enough to write in support, they would most definitely be in attendance at meetings.That was clearly and most apparent that apart from a few with vested interests, there was a notable absence of supporters.Even with the general concensus of negativity and discontent about the development, very few will actually put pen to paper.We've had some appalling examples of manipulation in recent months. The fake front page on the Hounslow Chronicle declaring huge support for the airport expansion was a disgrace and a method of advertising which should be outlawed.It has also completely undermined the impartial journalistic credibility of one of our last surviving local newspapers. The Brentford FC application was manipulated, and even amongst fans there is a degree of consternation about what was said and implied in their name. A great many fans are unhappy about moving at all and a great many split about the 'benefits' of the new venue given it's lack of improved infrastructure around the stadium.It would seem fake letters and people having their names and details lifted from the electoral register may well be going on and as no-one gets a specific acknowledgement they will never know. All to easy for PR companies to manipulate and they do in every way imaginable.There certainly needs to be a better means of testing and checking.

Anthony Waller ● 4047d

It is occasionally the case that letters of report are received in some quantity. I remember when I was part of the Campion Concerns campaign group in Osterley in the late 2000s, our group ended up encouraging locals via newsletter to support the development which ended up being built as it was by far the best option that had been proposed. Another parallel would be with Brentford FC fans writing in favour of the new ground. However, I do not believe any such campaign was mounted in favour of the Brentford High Street development. It might be interesting to know how many letters of support were received for somewhere comparable like the Scottish Widows site. Faked support from locals is not unknown - also in Osterley I was part of a smaller campaign to prevent an unsuitable major house extension. Even that got two fake letters of support despite being a much smaller issue than BHS.

Ian Speed ● 4053d

This came straight out of last weeks Chronicle.

Raymond Havelock ● 4061d

You're being silly again Guy.

Keith Iddon ● 4062d

I had a look on the council website last night but can't find anything about this planning application/approval - anybody else tried?The innuendoes coming out on this site about council sleaze would be concerning if anybody could come up with one iota of evidence. As it is, they make the writers as worthy of respect as The Sun's Hillsborough correspondent.

Guy Lambert ● 4062d

Does sound rather like the flawed survey about Heathrow."Answer no and plague and pestilence will fall upon your houses. Now, which of the third runway options would you prefer?"

Nigel Brooks ● 4062d

Planning officers usually dismiss the less objective objections or those that are not relative to the protocol they follow.So it is interesting that a rather flimsy and whimsy questionaire should be accepted and weighted towards the recommendations of the officers.I wonder what a similar version against would have brought about or been received?That's twice in a week that I've suggested an investigation. !! Is this just the tip of the iceberg?

Raymond Havelock ● 4063d

That's a real surprise, not.

Keith Iddon ● 4063d

Letters of support/objection are a matter of public record and are available to be read. Not that I've tried.As to all the letters of support, as I understand it, there was a survey done by a PR company which asked nice open questions (like whether you'd like to see the high street done up) which boosted support.

BrentfordTW8 Editor ● 4063d

Personal information could be redacted save for the supporting postcodes. That would make interesting reading in determining how many letters of support were from local residents/businesses.

Nigel Brooks ● 4063d

Agreed Jeff and Raymond. I think there should be some mechanism whereby we are allowed to see and read the support letters and the objection letters come to that. Fobbing off and disdain seem to be the order of the day.

Keith Iddon ● 4064d

I was amazed to read that this development had well over 550 letters of support.If that is not suspicious I don't know what is.Everyone knows that only objectors put pen to paper.  Objections are usually fuelled by a passion for the area in which one lives or works and the threat this may bring.I do not know a soul who supports the development as proposed and they don't know anyone either. But I do know others who actively objected .  I know several who are neutral on it and some who are OK about it but none who would go as far as writing a letter of support for it.People simply do not do it.  It would always be outweighed by those who complain as dissatisfaction primes action. Satisfaction is complacency.Clearly, there has been something fishy going on. Have residents had their details lifted off the electoral register by a PR agency and sent letters of support that they will know nothing about.?Have supporters been created?It would not be the first time a PR agency in the planning domain has done such a thing.Every single letter of support and objection should be checked for authenticityor made available for inspection.Did all these people get a letter of acknowledgement to their home address?Were all these supporters local residents?If it were not so bizarre a figure one would not raise an eyebrow but this is so out of scale for a widely unpopular design that probing questions should have been asked.Just like with the housing association debacle, this really ought to be fully independently investigated.

Raymond Havelock ● 4064d