Forum Topic

Consultation on expansion at Heathrow closed on December 19

Hounslow Council has a long held position that Heathrow should be better, not bigger – and ‘The Council believe that the benefits of proximity to Heathrow need to be greater for the whole community. The Council want Heathrow to be a better neighbour and be more responsive to residents’ views.’ – So what exactly is ‘better’ and what are the ‘residents’ views’?

Martin Case ● 2795d14 Comments

The former Director of regeneration and the environment, the chap that liked to cycle to Cannes (and fly back) to promote building spectacularly inappropriate developments before joining one of them, and might have been the driving force behind Hounslow's pro-Heathrow policy, had the right idea.  He lives way out in the countryside, where the air is clear and the sounds of nature abound.

Lorne Gifford ● 2783d

Might add that Paris CDG , Schiphol and many other European airpots and most  key airports around the world have replaced many earlier locations to abate issues of noise, various types of pollution, access, and above all take off and landing approaches over urban areas.Heathrow will end up being one of the last international airports with approaches over a major urban sprawl and those the only way of dealing with it's fall out is to inflict restrictions upon the populous affected by it which is a huge amount of people.Fact is Heathrow is now an outmoded relic of the past and the true benefits of new technology aircraft and infrastructure systems will improve but not really benefit in the way they do for CDG or AMS.  The same reductions in noise and pollution will benefit them by a far higher percentage simply because of the wisdom of their location and the forward thinking in their infrastructure.You could plate Heathrow with Gold and make it a stunning first class venue, but it won't change is very basic flaws.The Runways Point the wrong way. And the volume of movements way too high to ever reduce the fall out.To affect not just a few thousand, but millions is quite illogical and, I suspect that if the original founders of London Airport had seen the volume of growth and mass use of air travel, they would have acted accordingly and with Gatwick would have become the principle Airport or Foulness/ Maplin would have been constructed.Rather like the freedom and prosperity that the small affordable private car brought to millions, the powers that be were in denial that the working class masses should be allowed to have such movement.  It was supposed to be for the upper echelons. Same attitude existed for Air Travel.So we end up with a road network intend for a much smaller section of the population and suffer the consequences, and similarly the same mindset applies the same to airports.And then on top of that we have an imbalanced population becoming over concentrated in one corner of the UK.Not much has been learned from the last 60 years.

Raymond Havelock ● 2783d

I haven't flown since 1982 so distances to the airport are irrelevant for me. However, I would point out that comparisons favouring Heathrow for us locals don't hold so much water once you get out of West London - even somewhere like Putney would offer a quick journey to Gatwick via Clapham Junction compared to quite a number of tube stops, let alone anywhere with a N or E postcode. In any case, the whole point that BA are making is that the costs of the runway as it stands can't easily be recouped from landing charges because aren't so bothered about landing at Heathrow that they're willing to pay the extra costs.

Ian Speed ● 2783d

Heathrow is by far the most noise polluting airport, with 725,500 people affected versus 238,700 at Frankfurt, 170,000 at Paris Charles de Gaulle and 43,700 at Amersterdam’s Schiphol. Adding runway 3 increases noise pollution to over a million people. When arguing for a third runway at Heathrow, many claim that air pollution will improve due to more efficient aircraft and vehicles. However, a Kings College paper found, ‘strong evidence that there has been no change in aircraft NOx emissions at Heathrow Airport over the past 11 years.The area around Heathrow is the second major hot spot for nitrogen dioxide (NO2) pollution after central London, with breaches of legal limits having been recorded for many years. Central London’s new ULEZ and the proposed runway 3 will likely see Hounslow promoted to become the most polluted borough.Brentford to Heathrow is about 40 minutes. Brentford to Gatwick is about 60 minutes. I personally use Gatwick whenever possible, because parking is cheap and easy.So for those that think Better = Bigger, rather than apply short-term selfishness, instead look around at the people that live in Brentford and make a new year resolution to gain a little morality.

Lorne Gifford ● 2783d

Also we need 24 hr operation so that traffic flows are at max 24 hours a day thus avoiding peaks.

Nicholas Beard ● 2784d

This resident wants a bigger airport with more flights. I prefer flying from Heathrow but dont like the premium you have to pay because its too small for the amount of traffic that wants to pass throughGatwick, Luton & Stanstead are too far and much more of a hassle. I have lived under Heathrow all my life and dont hear the planes. Couldnt care less if a few more are in the air. I wonder when you last really noticed the planes?A lot of people I know work at or for a company that supplies the airport / airlines. Bigger = Better

Graham Cooper ● 2784d

Heathrow are launching a 10 week public planning consultation on their proposed expansion and future operations on 17th January. This is an opportunity to express our views on reducing environmental and community impact, so do please take the time to try and get involved. Heathrow are also planning consultation exhibitions in local communities where people will be able to talk to members of the Heathrow team about their proposals, the details of the locations will be made available in the New Year. Here’s a link Heathrow Expansions site for more information -  https://www.heathrowexpansion.com/press/heathrow-expansion-planning-consultation-launch-marks-next-delivery-milestone/

Martin Case ● 2788d

"These are the real issues which are worrying to residents of Hounslow and it would be useful to know whether LBH Council shares these concerns and if so have made those concerns known?We all want Heathrow to be a better neighbour and do please continue to use all you have in your armoury to persuade them to be so."I am disappointed that Hounslow has not sent a voice to the Heathrow Airport Consultative Committee meetings over the last two years (apart from one occasion where Steve Curran represented London Councils) :http://www.hacc.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/HACC-attendance-Jan-2016-to-Jul-2017.pdfAs HACC metamorphoses into a "Community Engagement Board" with a bigger role to "act as the focal point for engagement between the airport, local authorities, community groups and passengers" I might hope that Hounslow would be represented.http://www.airportwatch.org.uk/2017/12/heathrow-seeks-chair-for-new-independent-community-engagement-board-applications-till-14th-january/

Tim Henderson ● 2792d

Guy, I’m merely pointing out that your wish list has much in common with the government’s own view particularly in respect of jobs.LHR gaining living wage accreditation was long overdue, and I suspect that pressure from The Living Wage Foundation had much to do with this, and whilst welcome will still not provide those employees with the ability to purchase affordable homes within Hounslow.Whilst your suggestion to Heathrow representatives asking for reduced parking at the Area Forum is admirable it seems somewhat incongruous with the airport’s current plans to double air freight and invest £800 million in car parking?Aircraft noise generated by Heathrow affects more people today than its five main European competitors combined. Expansion will bring a 50% increase in flights, with more than 300,000 residents overflown for the first time many of whom will be residents of Hounslow.The Government admits respite would reduce and the NPS says Heathrow should provide a 6½ hour night flight ban, but the WHO recommends 8 hours to avoid health risks from night noise.If the government does fail it will be through the efforts of Client Earth and other pressure groups and Ruth but more likely through the government’s own inadequacies in producing a legally compliant air quality plan as already identified in the Airports National Policy Statement. These are the real issues which are worrying to residents of Hounslow and it would be useful to know whether LBH Council shares these concerns and if so have made those concerns known?We all want Heathrow to be a better neighbour and do please continue to use all you have in your armoury to persuade them to be so.As an aside I think you’ll find it was Philip Hammond who first coined the expression ‘better not bigger’.

Martin Case ● 2793d

MartinI have no idea why you say I appear to take the government's line. I take my own, which is to oppose a third runway.I also have no idea why you say it's 'nothing more than a wish list and politicking'. A local authority, never mind a ward councillor, has little power over government policy though like anybody else I can and do make my opinions plain and take part in petitions, demonstrations etc.As to the 'wish list' - some of those wishes are bearing fruit, for example with LHR employment practices https://www.employeebenefits.co.uk/issues/november-2017/heathrow-airport-gains-living-wage-accreditation/Had you attended the area forum last month you would have seen me and other councillors challenging Heathrow representatives on various matters, for example suggesting they should reduce parking and prioritise access for public transport users rather than car/taxi travellers.The 3rd runway may or may not happen. IMO it's looking slightly less probable now because the government is weak and the likes of Ruth are working on parliamentarians of all parties. But at the end of the day it is a government decision.Whether or not it happen, we want Heathrow to be a better neighbour and all we have in our armoury to promote this is persuasion, or 'politicking' as you might put it. The evidence suggests that our efforts may be having some effect

Guy Lambert ● 2793d

Thanks Guy I think most of us are aware of Ruth’s position on Heathrow Expansion. However, four other LA’s, Wandsworth, Hillingdon, Richmond and Windsor & Maidenhead have all at least made their opposition very public and clear, and whilst your long better wish list is very worthy it is just that nothing more than a wish list and politicking.  You also appear to take the governments line, so are we to presume this is your own or that of LBH’s?

Martin Case ● 2793d

Your local MP Ruth Cadbury has been fighting energetically against Heathrow expansion for years, probably decades.Of course there are benefits from Heathrow as well as penalties. Many thousands of people directly employed and tens of thousands more jobs attracted by its proximity.Better not bigger? Well, how about paying all staff (including subcontractors) the London Living Wage; reducing the use of private transport (including taxis) to limit congestion and pollution; more restrictions on night flights and better respite periods; promoting the use of quieter and/or less polluting aircraft by varying landing charges; investing in local infrastructure such as rail links; providing compensation and/or practical help to mitigate noise/pollution effects in homes, schools etc; community payback in terms of money to support community projects; opportunities for local people via training, apprenticeships etc; commitment to employ local residents in jobs at all levels.All of those might help and there has been progress on some of them.

Guy Lambert ● 2794d

Nobody is going to listen to local residents. MP's want jobs? Everybody wants jobs.

Nicholas Beard ● 2794d

"the benefits of proximity to Heathrow need to be greater for the whole community. "  That must be  thunderous noise,  belting out noxious fumes and pollutants, ditto static  traffic jams all round the airport - such great benefits to all the community!

Jennifer Selig ● 2795d