Forum Topic

SOCIAL HOUSING REVOLUTION in NORWICH

I've seen the future and it's Norwich: the energy-saving, social housing revolution The 100 homes on Goldsmith Street aren’t just smart and modern. They may be the most energy-efficient houses ever built in the UK. Could this be the start of proper social housing? See full article with lovely photographs which I don't know how to post on here  https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2019/jul/16/norwich-goldsmith-street-social-housing-green-designCome along Hounslow - make us some beautiful new council homes as per Norwich Council's.   Surely you have room in Brentford - so much better than those faceless concrete boxes Ballymore are erecting. .

Jennifer Selig ● 2220d29 Comments

Goldsmith Street won the Royal Institute of British Architects' prestigious Stirling Prize 2019!  Let's hope we get some more low-energy family housing.

Philippa Bond ● 2134d

Thank you.  My step daughter shared a flat on a huge estate  in the Elephant & Castle area (NOT for the faint hearted!) back in the eighties.  It was a buy to let one, thankfully they were able to sell it, not for any great profit, just months before the Council embarked on a huge modernisation project which would have cost them thousands of pounds.  The council tenants would not have had to pay a penny though.  I take your point that now things have changed and tenants all pay a proper market rent.

Jennifer Selig ● 2205d

Thank-you Peter - I wasn't quite sure who that question was being directed at!Many tenants do care for and nurture their homes and do general repairs and also decorate. My parents lived most of their lives in council accomodation and my Dad did everything by and large as did most of their neighbours, one of the reasons we bought our house under RTB was because the work the council did on our home was - how to put this kindly - shoddy - it was new roof, etc. I saw wall paper hung horizontally, paper so badly hung it was curling up and coming off the walls, I even saw an extractor fan removed and the hole just left and wall papered over! We had always done all our own maintenance etc. These are people's homes after all. The fault with RTB was that councils could not spend the capital receipts to replace the homes that were being sold, and the appalling lack of council house building before and after that by governments of every political hue. As for this subsidy nonsense - our house was built in 1918 - it was rented out until we bought it in 1982 - don't you think that the council got their money's worth over that time? 'Affordable' in government speak is 80% of the MARKET RATE - and 80% of that in London is colossal and way, way out of most people's reach.

Vanessa Smith ● 2206d

1) Council social rents aren't 'subsidised'. Over time the low rents more than cover the cost of the original development. 2) Repairs and maintenance isn't 'free' for council tenants. There's an element in their rent to cover it.3) A council home no longer being a home for life and repeatedly means testing council tenants with a view to evicting them if they're earning 'too much' would be a major change of policy which even the Tories weren't prepared to pursue when they abandoned George Osborne's 'Pay to Stay' proposals in 2016.

Peter Evans ● 2207d

I'm sure that's just rubbish of course they know that any house/flat costing 200 times as much as your salary is not affordable - they just don't want to say.I see that nether of you have answered my previous question about salary rich households receiving subsidised rents and free home/building maintenance.  | don't expect them to have to move out of their Council house or flat but I do think they could well afford to pay a proper rent and contribute towards the maintenance.  Thatr would free uo some cash for the many other poor sods who can't even afford to feed their children properly.

Jennifer Selig ● 2207d

I dont think they know what affordable is!

Nichols Beard ● 2207d

Did you see George Clarke's programme on Ch. 4 last night? At last someone talking sense and not stigmatising social housing, if the government are at all serious then this is one of the people they need to get on board to push things. Saw that stupid Esther McVey on the news wittering about 'affordable housing' when will one of these reporters challenge this language and ask these government twonks to define 'affordable'?

Vanessa Smith ● 2207d

The stoney silence means you are happy to subsidise high earning families living in properties that they don't even have to maintain themselves!  I find that extraordinary when Councils are apparently so stretched for cash.

Jennifer Selig ● 2210d

I will just comment that I do object, especially when councils are stretched for cash apparently, in providing subsidised rents where several people living in the same home are all working and earning.  In those case, by all means provide the house/flat but then levy an appropriate rent.  After all, these tenants get their repairs and maintenance all paid for whilst the rest of us have to fork out for everything ourselves.  The Council should of course provide that work up to a proper standard, unlike the poor devils with the useless wet room!

Jennifer Selig ● 2212d

I agree, Andrew except it was 13 years that New Labour were in power and failed to get a handle on this any better than anyone else.Seems like it wasn't top of their priority list, even though they encouraged migration to this country whilst failing to plan for the fact that more people = more need for affordable housing.Seems almost like changing deck chairs on the Titanic whoever you vote for sometimes.

Keith Iddon ● 2213d

Councils have no power to stop anyone buying their house under right to buy. It would need a change in legislation. The Tories won’t do it so it would need a Labour government to affect such a change. The last one showed no signs of doing so.

Andrew Sibley ● 2213d

Can individual boroughs put a stop to it? - the sale of Council houses, that is.

Anne England ● 2213d

Right to buy is the problem and is the reason why councils are reluctant to invest in social housing. Labour had 10 years in government to do something about it but did nothing. Will Corbin put a stop to it if he ever becomes Prime Minister? I doubt it.

Andrew Sibley ● 2213d

According to the figures London councils have moved almost 24,000 families out of London for re-housing. When you think about it - do you think that can be right? That people who need really affordable housing can be treated in this manner, moving families away from their jobs, support and friends and importantly, children's schools. Why should anyone in this day and age be treated like this for the want of decent housing? To put some perspective on it - the people who trash homes are a very small minority who are highlighted by more than excessive publicity, the vast majority of people value and look after their homes, and live in peace and quiet taking pride in their local communities. It would be up to a local council to decide in these cases whether or not a tenant had made themselves intentionally homeless, in which case they would have no legal responsibility to re-home them.

Vanessa Smith ● 2213d

So you're blaming nasty London Councils are you?  Tenants full of resentment trash free homes!  This was BEFORE the Olympic Park etc was planned!  It was ugly, greedy people wanting a mansion supplied for nothing, insisting it was their right to have such a place handed to them.  I despair but hopefully this is only the few, most tenants being careful and considerate, making these places supplied at reduced rents their cosy. safe, clean homes.  Let's hope so.I still maintain that the councils could and should be building settlements with pleasant streets, squares and homes  like the Norwich prize winning development.

Jennifer Selig ● 2213d

Harwich seems to have a lot of people who were moved out of London by the Councils when the Olympics buildings were being built.  I think many would have been happier if they hadn't had to move out.  That doesn't condone the way people treat the homes that they have been given to live in and which they should have been taking care of.

Philippa Bond ● 2214d

"I didn't see the statement referring to "everyone who is a council tenant" in Jenifer's post."And I didn't say she did!

Vanessa Smith ● 2214d

I can believe it.  Some people just have no idea how to look after themselves or any property they may happen to live it.  They wallow like pigs in muck.  Don't tell me that the poor long suffering schools should be educating their pupils!  Of course teach kids how to cook, sew on a button and manage a household budget and bills.  It really does seem as though women from puberty think nothing of getting pregnant, dropping a baby and trusting "someone" to provide a roof over their heads, leaving them free to carry on as though they are still single!  What a world!

Jennifer Selig ● 2214d

"Neither can you tar everyone who is a council tenant with the same brush."1. I didn't see the statement referring to "everyone who is a council tenant" in Jenifer's post.2. Jennifer's friend had bad experience with 3 out of 3 council tenants. I fully understand why she doesn't want any more.3. I wonder what do councils do with the few inconsiderate council tenants? And one doesn’t have to go as far as Harwich – there are a few in Hounslow, as well.

Alex Shpinkov ● 2214d

I have watched this Vanessa and agree some accommodation with mould on the walls and damp seeping in through ill fitting windows is unfit for anyone to live in and then to be expected to pay rent for such atrocious housing is beyond the pale.

Jennifer Selig ● 2215d

"She then gave up renting to Council tenants and who could blame her!  You can't blame that behaviour on the Tory Government!"Neither can you tar everyone who is a council tenant with the same brush.Do you watch 'Nightmare Tenants Slum Landlords' on Channel 5 - suggest you do as it does give a reasonably balanced picture of what both 'sides' are up against. Some people are just pigs and have no regard for anything, quite how they live in the filth they do is beyond most normal people, and that applies across the board.

Vanessa Smith ● 2215d

Have you actually seen what some people do to initially lovely rented accommodation?  I have first hand - a friend of  mine used to rent out three terraced houses in Harwich.  I could not believe the atrocious mess tenants left these homes in.  One lot wanted a house with more than 3 bedrooms. The Council didn't have any to offer and anyway said 3 bedrooms was ample for this particular family.  What did the family do - they trashed the house ripping rads. from the walls, breaking the outside door locks, ripping out the WC and breaking both sink and washbasin and stealing the taps.  God knows what they'd smeared on the walls and floor - dog/human shit?  They then fled leaving overdue rent unpaid.  The other two houses also let to Council tenants were not much better but at least most of the fittings were intact.It appears a lot of people do not value anything that is given to them!  It cost my friend a fortune to put right the damage.  She then gave up renting to Council tenants and who could blame her!  You can't blame that behaviour on the Tory Government!

Jennifer Selig ● 2215d

We've had a lot of home makeover programmes mostly simply to create dreams for the well off.  It would be good to find more tried and tested safe solutions for updating older properties.  The idea that buildings should be designed to be flexible enough to last your lifetime is a good one.  Some of the programmes about alterations to homes that local lad Nick Knowles has presented have been inspirational.  I wish there were more.

Philippa Bond ● 2216d

George Clarke a lad who grew up in a council house and whose Mum still lives in the very same property is doing a new Channel 4 series - 'George Clarke's Council House Scandal'. He wants to show there should be no negative stigma to living on a council estate.Suggest this should be compulsory watching for every councillor and MP in the country - as George Clarke points out "I have seen, and I continue to see, so many lives being wrecked by not having a decent roof over their head. Hard-working families who really want to do good. It makes me feel a bit ashamed that we've allowed the country to get into this position"......"I hope that we're not in a society where we don't care."

Vanessa Smith ● 2216d

Wouldn't it be great if we could have proper homes like that built in Brentford. And to be available for permanent rent at affordable rates. Can but dream. Current system is completely broken.

Jo Francis ● 2216d

So the Govt has declared a Climate Change Emergency, Hounslow Council has too and so has the RIBA.  Any declarations from the developers?  Can we be sure that we will now be getting low fuel buildings that are fit to deal with the more challenging climate conditions?

Philippa Bond ● 2217d

Same architects as Brentford Lock West Phase 2.You'll see some of the probs Councils face when you read the article.Tory govt has made it difficult for ideological reasons.  Councils are still losing homes and money from Right to Buy.

Philippa Bond ● 2218d

MONEY MONEY!  Norwich is a Labour controlled Council - they managed to do it so why can't Hounslow - that Barracks site would be an ideal place.  How to suggest that to Hounslow Council though.  Who would one contact to kick it off?  I'm sure Norwich Council would be helpful - they'd like to be asked for advice - it's human nature.  Ideas anyone?

Jennifer Selig ● 2219d

Local paper has an article about the plans for Hounslow Cavalry Barracks which are due to be vacated by the Irish Guards who will relocate at sometime in the future. The site has 14 listed buildings and 10 locally listed and comprises 15 hectares.Hounslow's cabinet approved the blueprint to allow potential developers to 'plan a future' for the site."The development will constitute a whole new neighbourhood for the borough, with plans for a mix of house types with half designated affordable housing."Which roughly translated means not many people can afford either option. What happened to social housing? Why isn't a supposed Labour council insisting on a proportion of this massive proposal being truly affordable, why do they consistently roll over for these blasted developers?

Vanessa Smith ● 2219d