Forum Topic

Boston Manor's Trees - are you concerned?

Are you concerned about Boston Manor's trees? We're trying to get some answers from the council and you could help by taking just 1 minute to answer 2 questions. You can also let us know how you feel via bostonmanor@saveourtrees.uk. Thanks! 🙏 https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/896MB8P

Jim Conroy ● 1150d31 Comments

Firestone also had a water outlet into the canal from tyre cooling. It is still there, although not active of course. I remember Charingtons having coal dropped directly from railway trucks into the lorries. It's as you say.

Nicholas Beard ● 1100d

I am very concerned for the destruction of the trees in the park and also the lack of maintenance of lot of trees in Brentford. I reported to the Council that some trees in the centre of Brenford have tangled wires (christmas decoration lights from 3, 4 years ago) and they are constricting the trees. I was told that was not to them to take the wires away (??!). It looks the only maintenance given is chopping away an put new treelets. Days later, I went for a walk to Boston Manor Park and  I felt horrified for the level of destruction going on: The brambles all gone, more ahead all treelets gone near canal gone, mud everywhere. And it is supposed we should make parks friendlier to insects and wild mammals because we are realising the importance of green natural areas for our survival and well-being....well not the case in Brentford :-( what is happening? Why this destruction? It looks there is a hate against trees and green areas. Do we have to remind experts that trees and green areas are hugely important for everybody?

Maria ● 1133d

The backdrop to the river is a metal recycling works and the dust and smell from a the waste transfer station and now the noise from the A4 as well as the M$ flyover.Those trees were there for good reason, to mitigate the industrial pollution and noise going right back to the Firestone works and the then very busy freight railhead.There were even more trees then than in the last 45 years.These 'experts' seem completely ignorant of this. I think they see themselves as the first environmentalists. Actually the creators of Victorian parks and those who planted trees of certain types were way ahead of their time.

Raymond Havelock ● 1141d

Neil, I believe he did but I'm not sure the Friends agree with that.According to officers: "Re the planning application. Extensive dialogue was had with Planning & Sports England, Spartans and Friends who all brought points forward during the process.In the case of the Friends they were already on the project design panels and forums so they were involved in co-designing the scheme. We took their responses on board through this design process and then walked them through all the proposals on site at the time of the application."I have also walked the site twice with the Friends in the last few months . In my view, the issue is not lack of consultation so much as  that views of what should be done differ so Friends believe they are not being listened to.Call it a vanity project if you will. The Grade 1 listed Jacobean mansion was under threat and the project will see it refurbished and (I believe) far more open to the public than it was previously.As to the park, much of the riverside was pretty inaccessible and when i walked there with the Friends in approx December I thought it was a much nicer place to be. I believe there will be a boardwalk through the woods and I think people will very much appreciate that. The fact that the park will be more open with reduced trees in places will please some and displease others. Equally, the ecological impact will no doubt be debated and disputed and I'm certainly not qualified to judge.Please come to the public (Teams) event on 25th March, which is focused on ecological matters I believe.

Guy Lambert ● 1141d

In Response To:'So it’s almost like a vanity project'No 'almost' about it!

Vanessa Smith ● 1141d

So it’s almost like a vanity project

Neil Chippendale ● 1142d

After 184 responses to our initial Facebook survey (many more than took part in the online “consultation” in February) and 50+ emails to key council members and local MPs… key council members have been in touch. Thank you Guy and Gaye 🙏🏻 ,it’s much appreciated.We’ve been offered a meeting on the 16th March to discuss the “Boston Manor Lottery Project”.We’ll be reaching out soon to gather your concerns and ideas to make sure that future meetings are more centered on the needs and wishes of visitors and local residents.You can stay in touch with the future of the park via the updated website which also has just a few of your comments on the impact of recent work.Your support is making a difference... Thank You 🙏https://saveourtrees.uk/latest-news/

Jim Conroy ● 1142d

Latest from facebook.CAMPAIGN WANTS "TO MAKE SURE FUTURE MEETINGS ARE MORE CENTRED ON THE NEEDS AND WISHES OF VISITORS AND LOCAL RESIDENTS". Jim Conroy reports: "After 184 responses to our initial Facebook survey (many more than took part in the online “consultation” in February) and 50+ emails to key council members and local MPs… key council members have been in touch. Thank you, Cllr Guy Lambert and Gaye Galvin, Parks Project Manager. It’s much appreciated."We’ve been offered a meeting on the 16th March to discuss the 'Boston Manor Lottery Project' (the name of the work being carried out)."We’ll be reaching out soon via the website to gather concerns and ideas to make sure that future meetings are more centred on the needs and wishes of visitors and local residents."https://saveourtrees.ukThe answer Neil is NO.

Vanessa Smith ● 1142d

One question. Did the consultant engage with the Friends from the very beginning of the process, in the very early planning stage.

Neil Chippendale ● 1142d

Guy, you suggested that my criticism of the council's lack of process was because I had a grudge against the council. Attacking peoples motives, rather than engaging with legitimate concerns, it is a cheap tactic.

Kathleen Healy ● 1144d

Kathleen, I don't think I've ever attacked either you or Linda. Or the bowls club for that matter.I don't always agree with what you (or Linda, or the bowls club) says but that's not the same thing.Linda has never attacked me either, as far as I can recall.

Guy Lambert ● 1144d

It is not only Friends of Boston Manor who have experienced this. Dukes Meadows Trust had the same experience and I am aware that other Friends groups are frustrated and hurt by how they are treated by the council. We are talking about people who work tirelessly with no other aim than to improve their local park for people to enjoy.Some years ago, when Dukes Meadows Trust was in the position of being marginalised, because the council, after years of neglect, saw an opportunity for a vanity project, Linda defended us. I am happy to do the same now and agree that she deserves an MBE. She may not want one of course, but I imagine if someone applied she would be recognised.Despite the obvious ability and community understanding of Friends Groups, who improve parks with little or no public money, we are excluded from the process, once a big vanity project is launched. It is galling, large sums are paid to consultants who parachute in and out and devise plans that alienate the community and often fail.There is a conflict between English Heritage's fetish for seeking to take a park back to an arbitrary period, it deems important, and preserving and enhancing the bio diversity of parks. Most people do not care or prefer more natural looking, bio diverse parks to recreated, manicured beds with lollipop trees in a grid pattern. These newly created beds and lawns are very high maintenance requiring the commercialisation of the park to generate the funds to maintain them. How such a narrow, bizarre and out of touch bias manages to be so dominant and appropriate so much public money is baffling. It seems to be a small club who occupy both English Heritage and HLF one handing money to the other. No one seems to have the gumption to challenge it.    Guy and other councillors are aware of the poor treatment of Friends Groups and Bowls Clubs etc. Also that people don't want their parks taken over by commercial ventures. When we turn to them for help, they attack us and defend the process, without engaging with our concerns. Our councillors seem to see their role as defending powerful and often narrow interest groups against the community, rather than representing the community that elects them.

Kathleen Healy ● 1145d

"agreed several years ago"  'Not for Publication"This is A Public Park, not a Missile Base.Nor is it a commercial venture. So no conflict of interests.So why the secrecy?  And no-one questioned that?It's local people who matter, not the profits of consultancies or advisors who often cannot relate a pie chart to reality.

Raymond Havelock ● 1145d

The important thing is what local people think. Most of them sound appalled. Admittedly it can't be said 'it's their money', as the funding has come from the HLF, but for the Friends group to quit in disgust is very embarrassing and sad. More of a balance should have been struck.

Ian Speed ● 1145d

Linda: you don't have an MBE? That's a worry especially when it is overwhelmingly deserving.My apologies though for the false news!In my mind you had been "honoured" at the same time as Pauline Hart th Chiswick Pensioners' Christmas Lunch chief organiser. The responses to this thread say it all Linda.You are a star...and deserving.

Jim Lawes ● 1145d

As Joan kindly confirmed, I do take the views of local residents seriously and there has been (and still is) a lot of disquiet over the changes to the park.When this was first raised with me last October I undertook a 'walkabout' in early November with various representatives of the Friends. Having understood some of their concerns I organised for the lead landscape architect to attend in early December, together with officers from the council and Greenspace 360 as well as representatives from the Friends group.Since physical attendance is impossible at present, the council is organising a series of Teams events: there was one on 25th February with the architect in attendance along with senior people from the council and Greenspace. There will be another one in March with the ecologist who advised on the programme in attendance probably the evening of 25th March though I don't think it's finalised.These plans are paid for by the National Lottery Heritage fund, who I believe have provided £3.6M for works to the park (separate from their sponsorship of works to the Manor House), were extensively consulted at the time (though inevitably people complain not extensively enough) and have the backing of English Heritage. I have in my possession a Conservation Management Plan running to 160 odd pages though this is marked 'Not for Publication'.I'm no ecologist but reading the documents and hearing the experts there is method in this apparent madness. The park was in need of investment and we're pleased that we persuaded the Lottery and English Heritage to bask these works. I know the Friends are unhappy with some of what's being done and I'm keen we take their concerns on board but the fundamental principles of these changes were agreed several years ago: the council, English Heritage and the Lottery Heritage Fund believe they will enhance the park both for visitors and for ecology.We are doing our best to explain what's going on and why so please come to the event in March if you can and read the project blog here https://www.hounslow.gov.uk/info/20168/parks_and_open_spaces/2272/boston_manor_park_blog

Guy Lambert ● 1145d

In the early years of the Friends of Boston Manor I was invited by Linda to chair the committee, a post I was happy and honoured to do. For some years we worked together creating a team and establishing the cafe to provide money and resources to improve the park which I believe we did.Despite our efforts Hounslow council were consistently officious and obstructive: promising much and delivering little. The reason why Brentford Festival (closely associated with the Friends) moved from Boston Manor to Blondin Park was LBH's inability to make decisions while at the same time charging the charitable Brentford Festival thousands of pounds for unnecessary work. I (acting with full knowledge of the then committee of Brentford Festival and the Friends) gave LBH a deadline, they failed and I told them we would move to Blondin.A couple of years later I endeavoured to get some security of tenure for the cafe. On behalf of the committee I sought some form of lease: after about two years of trying, with interminable changes of personnel at LBH, I gave up and resigned. I'm afraid there's a limit to my patience.It sad, but not surprising that FoBM are planning to leave. Why LBH have to be such control freaks is beyond me: I wouldn't mind so much if they were efficient.Linda Massey may not have an MBE, but she deserves one.Thanks Linda, Sally, Gordon and all the others who have over the years have raised so much money to improve the park.

John Bradley ● 1146d

If the potty idea that's been proposed for a craft market does go ahead - it will be a surprise if it works. Things like that need good footfall and to be in a park away from a town centre I'm afraid it is doomed to be a damp squib. When will councils get it that parks are for walking, playing games, taking the dog for excercise and just sitting to appreciate open space and nature. The trees, shrubs and flowers provide a home for so many creatures and are so valuable for encouraging biodiversity in our towns and cities. If this last year hasn't taught people that - then there's something really wrong with them. parks were never meant to be, and are not, commercial money makers unless you try and do what the bunch of vandals at Hounslow are. To forge ahead and not have the basic decency to hold a proper consultation, and work from the outset with the Friends who have done so much is unforgiveable and arrogant.

Vanessa Smith ● 1146d

I've just been for a walk around the park, first for a while. Very sad to see trees chopped down for no reason especially the ones near the cafe but I think the clue lies in the notice board near the football changing rooms. Among the description for future park use is the word 'corporate', I guess we can only wait and see what happens.

Pat Kingham ● 1146d

Hounslow council cannot wiitter on about improving biodiversity on the one hand and then rampage through a park destroying habitat willy-nilly. The Friends have worked their tails off for many years and deserve so much better than being treated like some sort of irritant to be shooed away. This is so not acceptable on any level.

Vanessa Smith ● 1146d

We go through Boston Manor fairly frequently on our constitutionals. Last weekend we were staggered at the number of trees that have been removed in most areas. I'm not an expert, and one like to think that LBH and their estate managers know what they're doing, but it seemed rather excessive to me.

Mike Paterson ● 1148d

I don't believe that the Councils have to maintain the parks by law.  However it is something that we expect them to. So we have to be worried.  Councils are mostly reliant on the money and grants they get from Govt and elsewhere.  Govt controls how much money they get from them (which has been enormously decreased) and how much they can increase Council Tax by and what for.I commented on the brutal cutting down of trees around the lake on cw4.com.  The initial impression was that it was in order to give a better view to sell or advertise something but then that could be cynical.  Some trees were obviously rotten inside but others weren't.  I looked on the website and there was a bit of an explanation. Remember that trees have to be cut before the bird nesting season or there is a problem with contravening the Wildlife & Countryside Act 1981.  However has the rush to do this may have meant that not enough consideration was given to what was going to be done.The small stumps are dangerous underfoot - and so are speeding cyclists coming downhill on the path into the park off the main road.  So walkers can be in trouble on the path or off. 

Philippa Bond ● 1148d

Jim Lawes - there are a lot of people behind my success - I am just the frontman (person).  Think you might be misleading people though - unless there is something you know about and I don't - I do not have an MBE. 😊

Linda Massey ● 1148d

The friends have turned the park around after decades of indecision and average maintenance.  Just like Gunnersbury Park.Quite why local involvement and knowledge is so despised is quite reprehensible.It would perhaps be understandable if the parks were fabulous and pristine and fully maintained by the authority. But they are not really.It's not unique.  The disgraceful shafting of the Coffee hut operator, a business built it from nothing with their own savings. Just to suit the desires of the elite group behind Pitzhanger Manor. Now we have a public park that has an area no longer truly public.The Councillors remained silent. The officer behind it was a bit of a Judas and is still up to his tricks with Gunnersbury and Lammas park 'initiatives'.Now we are seeing it with Hounslow.  The CiC in Gunnersbury is a loose cannon not giving a fig about genuine local community and seemingly riding roughshod over those at Boston Manor who have made the difference and for free.If councils could really afford to do things properly and consistently to a high standard fine, but they cannot manage what others can do and do for nothing.But the arrogance and ignorance that seems to be purveying in some parts is just yet another on a growing list of poor management and communication which almost seems deliberate and contemptuous towards local people especially those that put in the hard work year in, year out.

Raymond Havelock ● 1148d

When you reflect on the amount of volunteering work performed by Linda Massey(MBE) and her loyal team in Boston Manor Park over many years...it seems incredulous that Hounslow Council can be seemingly so bloody minded and disrespectful to her.Linda's performance running those Brentford Festivals in the Park were mightily impressive and memorable.

Jim Lawes ● 1148d

This story chimes with my own experience that public sector employees are often suspicious and resentful of people who give their own time for nothing. They may feel volunteers devalue the work they do particularly when the people are more committed and qualified.

Jeremy Parkinson ● 1149d

I cannot imagine what twisted thoughts have gone into doing this. There should have been liaison with the Friends Group and several opinions sought before all the trees were removed in this manner. What a disgusting organisation Hounslow Council is.

Ian Speed ● 1149d

I have walked in this park most days for many years. I was saddened and shocked to see the wholesale wanton destruction going on with trees being cut down for no apparent reason.  When I inquired of the chainsaw wielding workmen I was told that my favorite trees the cherries by the cafe had to come down because they had fungus. I examined what was left of the trees and could find no sign of this fungus so I again asked  pointing out that the last tree standing looked fine. I was told to take it up with the Council. Obviously there is now nothing left to take up with the Council as the tree was felled within the hour.

Robert Ayres ● 1149d

Jim - please note the email address doesn't work.

Ian Speed ● 1149d

This sounds like an utter disgrace. I can't recall seeing a single post in favour other than someone from the council with an axe to grind.

Ian Speed ● 1149d

Thank you Jim, I have completed the survey. Since last September I have e-mailed Councillors and Lampton 360 regarding the destruction taking place in our park. No one has addressed my specific issues; I have received what I consider a 'text book' response to my e-mails, with the exception of Guy Lambert, who at least appreciates the feelings of park lovers. Standard response from a Councillor is always about 'opening up the park' - well some of us like secluded places to walk in; some of us want to retain hidden areas for wildlife - is this not what green spaces are supposed to be about?  Added to this, Boston Manor park must be one of the most polluted parks in London with the M4 above, so why rip out hundreds of trees?  Now the hedges around the cafe have been removed - not to mention the destruction around the pond. It is absolutely horrific.

Joan Adamson ● 1150d