Forum Topic

The proposal does include provision (up to a point) for an arts centre. It is reduced in size from the previous planning approval: the council say it's because there is no demand for a cinema because Brentford already has one.The real reason is that there is not enough money in the deal to provide a centre at the level previously approved. The provision for an arts centre began with a budget of £20M and a large theatre, because Arts Counicl England wanted to provide a 500 seater theatre to accommodate a West London Dance centre.That was cut early on, because the ACE had no money for it and the developer said there was only £10M budget. Then that became £7M because the developer had already bought the site and was incurring interest costs. At that stage, a plan for a reduced size arts centre with cinemas, theatre, cafe, rehearsal rooms etc was included in the costing.Then it all fell apart, partly because Michael Gove called for a public enquiry. The public enquiry agreed with what had been agreed earlier by Hounslow but a few years, legal costs and more interest costs had accrued. Then we had Brexit (construction costs went much higher and many skilled builders left the UK) Truss (interest costs went through the roof) new building regs post Grenfell meant extra staircases had to be provided. So the proosal now is for a smaller empty shell for the arts centre and the council will (if all goes to plan) call on arts providers to bid for the design, construction and operation of an arts centre.There is also when I last looked a large deficit in the finances - I have heard £50M shortfall mentioned. Whether there is a realistic prospect of any of this being built is beyond my ken. We were told in 2024 that there would be spades in the ground last summer. Now the story is that there 'could' be spades late this year.In reality, I am sceptical about that unless there is a magic money tree somewhere in national or local government. But of course schemes like this are very sensitive to interest rates (likely to fall) building cost inflation (anybody's guess) and what happens to house prices (ditto)

Guy Lambert ● 8d

Guy does seem keen to blame everyone else for the inactivity with Waterman’s, but he’s not being entirely honest.The call in of the proposal by the Secretary of State was entirely legal and part of the process due to the impact of any development on Kew Gardens, which is a Workd Heritage Site and has protected characteristics. Just because Guy didn’t like it, doesn’t mean it was incorrect for it to have happened.As for Covid, well nobody knew that was coming except perhaps some Chinese scientists in Wuhan.Truss was a disaster but the construction industry was already in difficulties before she came along, largely due to the exodus of foreign builders from the UK. Many Poles went back home because the economic opportunities there were better than in the UK, with low business taxation and better standards of living fuelling an economic boom there. Now, I wonder which current government is stifling the UK with idiotic policies? Probably the one Lsmbert was so enthusiastic about 18 months ago!Guy also ignores the way those running the old Waterman’s ran it into the ground. Its offer became so niche nobody was particularly beating a path there. Meanwhile, events that were attractive were simply not advertised by the organisation either on its website or in-house. Surely the councillors who sat on the board of trustees all those years, including one G Lambert, might have noticed there were problems but seemed to do nothing about it.As were elsewhere in Brentford things are being built, but an arts centre is about the lowest priority for a developer because it doesn’t bring the 25-30 percent profits routinely expected from any project.It has been open to the council to put in a Compulsory Purchase Order on the site to break the deadlock - as happened with the Filmworks site in Ealing - but the time for that has probably now passed.Don’t hold your breath on a new Waterman’s, folks. And any pre-election promises from Cllr Lambert that he will push it forward should be taken with a big pinch of salt.

Simon Hayes ● 33d

It wasn't fobbing off, though the finances were always very cahllenging.We did finally approve a plan a few years ago at planning (I voted in favour, unlike many other ones such as the Morrisons redevelopment, Goddards self-store on the canal and the redevelopment of the old Homebase).Then in his infinite wisdom, Michael Gove called the decision in. There was a public enquiry (which took a year or 3 to set up, run and report). The commissioner completely agreed with the decision of the planning committee so all Gove did was delay it.Meanwhile Brexit and the pandemic happened and a lot of E European workers went back to E Europe, Truss happened so the housing market was devastated and the changes in building regulations after Grenfell led to a new proposal being needed.The Cabinet members have been trying to get a new proposal and they have one, but I have problems with it: it is not currently viable (though there may be government subsidy in the wings); there is no real plan for the arts centre and I don't think any funding (It's just a shell for whoever is going to run the centre); there is currently virtually no affordable housing. I understand why, because the market is yet to recover. My complaint about planning is that the committee (formerly elected from Labour and separately from Conservative members) is now on the Labour side simply appointed by the leader and includes people like Tom Bruce who clearly has a conflict of interests between his redevelopment job and democratic oversight.Not a single application has been refused or deferred by the planning committee for at least 12 months. We might as well abolish it

Guy Lambert ● 38d

It has new planning applications P/2025/2496 for the police site and p/2025/2495 for the riverside site (IE the old Watermans and Max Factor buildings)As local councillors we had no preview of those other than an assurance that something was coming. I was upset about that - in previous years we were closely engaged with such important proposals but that important part of democracy appears to have been abolished in Hounslow.Following protests from me and from Katherine Dunne (and perhaps others) we have been informed "officers are working on organising a briefing session for all Brentford ward councillors early November and a public presentation a meeting the middle/end of November. "My understanding is that the application is seen as viable but has some concerns expressed by Brentford Voice and the Friends of Watermans Park and some matters seem to be missing according to planning experts.Of course we do not know of the opinion of other stakeholders, especially the Royal Palaces who caused Michael Gove to call in the previous approved application. The Planning Inspector finally agreed with the council and its planning committee (not the Royal Park objection) but by the time that was settled, we had had a pandemic, Brexit, new regulations after the impact of Grenfell and a weakening of the housing market. That includes special difficulties for Housing Associations whose involvement will be crucial - much of their funds these days go to improving exusting sites following Grenfell, a factor which has given us a new lease from Lidl on the former Morrisons site let by the L&Q Housing Association. Not necessarily a bad outcome because Lidl is an asset and both I amd Mel Collins voted against the original Morrisons redevelopment. I look forward to the promised engagement and I hope that leads to a new Arts centre in a short timescale.

Guy Lambert ● 114d