Forum Topic

SmallBerryGreen Primary School Summer Fete

Friday 7th December 330 - 5pm in the main HallFree EntryALL welcomePlenty of stalls, Tombola, Refreshments and RafflesOrganised by the Friends of SmallberrygreenTurnpike Way or Gate opposite West Middlesex HospitalBus Route 267 and 235please Come Along and show your support.

Simon Anderson ● 6791d29 Comments

"His view was that the education in faith schools was not in actual fact any better than anywhere else, but because of the faith aspect the schools had a more 'community' feel about them because parents and pupils tended to know one another better and get more involved in things. So the faith was the glue holding the ethos of the school together."Exactly. Which makes it incredible that anyone would even think of abolishing a system that works so well. The local faith schools are overwhelmingly used by children who are first and second generation immigrants yet they achieve fantastic results. This is partly due to the wider network of support provided by the community and the Church but also the extra sense of vocation that the teachers have. Closing down our best local schools because of some nonsense view that they are divisive is as bonkers as not holding school Christmas fairs.

Andy Jones ● 6763d

Oh dearie me - bit ratty aren't we? I too read an article about faith schools in The Guardian last week, from a teacher who worked in a faith school even though he did not share the denomination of the school. He was prevented from teaching certain subjects because of this and was even told when considering applying for a promotion that he could apply but he wouldn't get the position because he wasn't a member of that particular faith. In actual fact he did eventually win a discrimination case, he was a good and well qualified teacher. His view was that the education in faith schools was not in actual fact any better than anywhere else, but because of the faith aspect the schools had a more 'community' feel about them because parents and pupils tended to know one another better and get more involved in things. So the faith was the glue holding the ethos of the school together. I have already said if you bothered to read it - that for me Christmas is a religious festival, but you will never convince me that religion should have anything to do with education unless taught as an academic subject. It is well past time Church and State were separated as they are in so many countries that are far more religious than this one. Pardon me for having an opinion.

Vanessa Smith ● 6764d

Mickwhats does SA Mean?

Simon Anderson ● 6764d

It's the SA show folks!

Mick OBrien ● 6764d

Vanessa, interestingly the article in yesterday's Standard by Trevor Philips (which sorry Simon I dumped on the way home from work) lauds the value of faith schools and points out that in London they have a much higher proportion of ethnic minorities than the average. Contrary to them being divisive, an argument that Mr. Philips has put forward in their favour is that they tend to prevent areas becoming ghettos because even if one race is dominant in an area the faith school assures diversity because of the wider catchment areas they have.  I have no desire to send my children to a faith school and even if I did it would be preposterous of me to claim discrimination if they didn't accept them. They are all chronically over subscribed by adherents of their faith and they own the schools and part fund their upkeep. It would not make sense for them to decline a place to a member of their congregation for someone who doesn't share their beliefs.If anything is divisive here it is the lack of balance that you use in your language on the subject of religion.

Dan Evans ● 6764d

I agree with much of what you say although I don't think the 'agggressive secularists' should shoulder all the blame, I think parents and teachers who want to look right-on and trendy are as much in the frame for this nonsense. Also although I do still think Christmas is a religious festival I am totally against faith schools, which I think are divisive and discriminatory, I think religion belongs in the home not in education unless it is taught as an academic subject. However, leaving all that aside another school in Chiswick is also having a Winter Fair, although I prefer the Winter I have never 'celebrated' it and I do think the general colour and excitement are what makes Christmas special for those who regard it as nothing more than an excuse for a break.

Vanessa Smith ● 6764d

KevinThanks 4 this i will do if anyone has yesterdays Standard i can have please let me knowThanks

Simon Anderson ● 6764d

Simon, pressure for change on this matter needs to come from within the school. If you feel strongly enough about it I would suggest getting a copy of yesterday's Standard in which Trever Philips the head of the Commission for Racial Equality makes an unarguable case for the rejection of the view that people of other faiths than Christianity find Christmas offensive. Zaki Cooper, an orthodox Jew made the same argument in the Guardian this Saturday as well. It would be a good idea to distribute one or both of these articles to the head and the PTA to avoid silly mistakes like this in the future.

Andy Jones ● 6764d

KevinIt was not my decision but the Schools..I agree it is silly it cant be called Christmas Fayre.....I think if people have a issue with it they should write to Smallberrygreen Primary School.

Simon Anderson ● 6768d

Yes it does matter. Most people of non-Christian beliefs are made very uncomfortable by this sort of thing because it portrays them as trying to change our way of life and as being unprepared to make compromise whilst we are expected to. They see it as creating resentment against them and none of the people of other faiths that I know has reacted with anything other than shock and disgust when things like this happen. It is divisive and popular only with the increasingly aggressive secularists who would like all faith based traditions abolished. It is also rubbish - nobody celebrates winter because winter is crap that is why the predominately non-religious festival of Christmas is so popular.

Andy Jones ● 6768d

Does it Really matter what its Called?As long as people enjoy themselves and we raise money for the School it don't really matter!!It is sill to stay away or be offended because it wasn't Called Christmas Fayre or even if it was called Christmas Fayre..

Simon Anderson ● 6768d

Thanks 4 All that came alongGreat AtmosphereNice to see Cllr Paul Fisher There (BTW Paul u won a Raffle I've got it here 4 u)Thanks Everyone!!

Simon Anderson ● 6768d

I think Sikh friends of mine would be too, I even have Muslim friends who always joined in our Christmas celebrations at work - this daft sort of thing is sheer lunacy in my view, and serves no purpose at all - except to get up a good few noses.

Vanessa Smith ● 6768d

Sorry - not P.C. enough!

Vanessa Smith ● 6768d

Vanessa,It may interest you to know that I was compelled to make this point by the fact that my mother in law, who is a Sikh, complained to me when she found out about this. She was most offended by the fact that it was assumed that she, and other Asians, would be offended if the word Christmas was used to promote the event.

Andrew Sibley ● 6768d

I was going to start by saying "With the greatest respect" but I won't because that is the most P.C. and stupid reason I have ever heard - what is wrong with these people? I never thought the day would dawn but Mr. Sibley has made some very pertinent points. Why on earth should we feel the need to apologise or feel guilty for wanting to celebrate a festival that has its roots in the days of yore? - Total cobblers! Sorry about the rant but this is just the sort of thing almost guaranteed to wind people up.

Vanessa Smith ● 6769d

Don't Forget Folks!!If your around pop into our School fayre...

Simon Anderson ● 6769d

Thank you for that information Simon. What worries me about this is the assumption that non christians will not attend a Christmas Fair. I am not a religious person but that does not mean that I do not attend events that have a religious theme. For example, I have attended many Christian weddings in churches, Sikh weddings in gudwharas (excuse the spelling if it is wrong), Diwali events and even Christmas fairs. Many of my family who are Sikh attend events of other religions and cultures. The fact is that most reasonable people who are not christians do not get offended at the thought of having to attend a christmas fair, or any other event of a different religion to their own, but yet some people still hang on to the notion that they do.If I am wrong then perhaps someone from one of the non christian faiths can come to this forum and correct me and I will be more than happy to offer my apolosies, or perhaps you agree with me and wish to say so.Finally I wish to add that both of my children attend Smallberry Green School. My eldest is taking part in this years chsistmas production. As in previous years I expect that children of many different cultures will be taking part as well. Having the word christmas in the title doesn't seem to put many kids off taking part and many of the kids' parents attending.

Andrew Sibley ● 6770d

The School Parent/Teacher Committee, It was declared that The School is a multi cultural school and it would not be pleasant to make others feel they were excluded from attending this fund raising event by naming it a Xmas fayre and thus suggesting a religious connotation which clearly is not present at such an event.

Simon Anderson ● 6771d

Who decided not to call it a Christmas Fair?

Andrew Sibley ● 6771d

Political Correctness Andy

Simon Anderson ● 6771d

Sureley it should be the Christmas Fair, or has that been dropped in the name of political correctness?

Andrew Sibley ● 6771d

Yes Winter Fayre...Whats wrong with that mate?

Simon Anderson ● 6772d

Winter Fair?

Andrew Sibley ● 6772d

Can I just thank all those who have bought raffle tickets from me, Especially Mary Mcleod and Cllr Paul Fisher.Raffle Tickets are Still Available..

Simon Anderson ● 6772d

Bump :-)

Simon Anderson ● 6772d

Don't Forget Folks!!Smallberrygreen Primary School Winter FayreFriday 7th December from 315pm in the main hallTombolaAdopt a TeddyRock StallBric and BracFace PaintingFather XmasHand Print PoemsRaffles (which Tickets are available at 20p each prizes inc a MP4 player and 2 Shredders)RefreshmentsAnd Loads moreAll WelcomeAll proceeds go to purchasing Buddy Benches for the school PlaygroundOrganised by the "Friends of Smallberrygreen"

Simon Anderson ● 6775d

opppS i meant Winter Fair thanks 4 pointing it out Paul..

Simon Anderson ● 6791d

Seems a bit late for a Summer Fete but hope all goes well and a lot of money is raised.

Paul Fisher ● 6791d