Forum Topic

Sean Penn is a moron

Absolutely furious to read in the paper today that Sean Penn that well known loudmouth thinks that the U.K. are displaying "ridiculous colonialism" over The Falklands. He's sucking up to the Argentine President, he thinks we should engage in "dialogue". I suggest he visits the islands and asks the people who live there what they would like. I seem to remember that 30 years ago the residents made it quite clear they want to be British, and if they change their minds I'm sure we'd clear off, they haven't, so we can't. As someone in the paper wrote last week, these people will never understand the British, we do not give in to bullies but we do know when to bow out.

Vanessa Smith ● 5189d31 Comments

It's you who's making a tit of himself.

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

Cheers, bosom buddy!

John Connelly ● 5186d

More cutting insight from Mac the Mouth.

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

Keith expects his to be removed on the NHS.

John Connelly ● 5186d

Didn't see it but by all accounts she did a good job on Newsnight when talking about these PIP boobie implant things that mostly vacuous barbie dolls are worried about

Claire Peleschka ● 5186d

She made a couple of outstanding points when I saw her on the tv the other night Phil.

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

I would agree with Keith here.  Actors, pop singers and celebrities in general tend in my view to be (a) more opinionated, but nonetheless (b) generally more thick than the man (or woman) on said omnibus.  Any enthusiam I might have for Katie Price, just to give an example, would have precious little to do with her opinions on macroeconomics and Scottish devolution.

Phil Andrews ● 5186d

Vanessa,Actors are not 'everyman' by any stretch of the imagination.'The man on the Clapham omnibus'will never get on Question Time because the bbc could never be certain what he said and has nothing to gain from the appearance.Public service broadcaster my arse!

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

At the amounts of tax revenue spent per head in Scotland as opposed to in England to see what a good deal the Scots are getting relatively speaking.Salmond should be careful what he wishes for imo as he may get it.

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

So Scotland owns the North Sea now?I don't understand how you can support people having a say on their future determination in Scotland but not in the Falklands.The oil by the way was extracted using Englis(mostly)companies taking a risk at getting their money back and making profit.

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

Economics is clearly not your forte, Keith. Having been subsidised from North Sea oil for the last 40 years your earlier post made it clear you intend to live off the backs of the Falklanders for the next 40!

John Connelly ● 5186d

Some people are still fighting the battles of Culloden and Bannockburn.Scotland is welcome to independence,if that's what it wants.As long as it is independence and not a heavily subsidised carping from the boundary at the hand that feeds it.

Keith Iddon ● 5186d

I can only say John, as far as many are concerned Scotland can go if that's what they want, but swapping Cameron for Salmond doesn't seem much of an improvement to me.

Vanessa Smith ● 5186d

JohnForgive me, but I just had a slightly weird vision of you saying all that in a Glasgow accent at the end of a heavy session and tittered a little.  Must be the sangria.

Phil Andrews ● 5186d

Vanessa, as the Act of Union was achieved by English suppression of Scots trade through actions such as the Navigation Acts it seems to me that a democratic act in England as the culmination of the process would be inappropriate. I do think, however, that if there is separation it will come about without more blood being added to the Butcher's Apron.

John Connelly ● 5186d

To be clear, I think the wishes of the people living on the Islands are paramount but I retain a healthy cynicism towards the motivations of politicians all the same.  As they don't seem to care a great deal for millions of people living in the UK and suffering the effects of their policies I am perplexed as to how they can become so animated about the fate of a few hundred people living on the other side of the world.  That's accepting that, like the wars in Iraq and Libya, it has nothing whatsoever to do with oil of course.

Phil Andrews ● 5187d

John, dear friend though you are I know that you are a  bolshie Scot but you also know that I am a very patriotic Englishwoman. I don't think this is such a big issue as Phil claims as it is not much of a distraction, and no amount of wittering by Cameron could make it so. I agree with you about Cameron's visit to Scotland I am sure most people are more concerned with jobs and welfare than the UN security council, although there is strength in  numbers, do you think that those of us south of the border should get a say in whether or not Scotland should be independent? I only ask as surveys indicate that were we to be asked you'd get more people voting yes down here than in Scotland! The Falklands are a fact of history, but we are where we are and we cannot just walk away.

Vanessa Smith ● 5187d

I am amused at the jingoism you have stimulated here, Vanessa.Keith's historical claims are, at best, contentious. The evidence seems to be that the first colonists of the islands were French, followed by competing claims between Argentina (its predecessor colony) and Britain. It was settled by force with the Argentinian Malvinas residents kicked out in favour of British colonists who named the islands the Falklands.As for Vanessa's claim that the British never give in to bullies, the fact that the Middle East is in such a mess was due precisely to that. The bullying of the Zionist lobby (and the USA) led to the abandonment by Britain of the Palestinian Christian/Muslim people to their fate.Incidentally, I think Cameron comes over as a moron when he goes north of the border and appeals to the unemployed, the disabled whose benefits are being cut, and the millions of others suffering under his cuts, on the basis that Scotland would lose its presence on the UN Security Council if they leave the UK. Up yours you dimwit Tory!

John Connelly ● 5187d

Both governments are using the quarrel for their own political advantage, just as both governments did in 1982.  The problem the Argentinian government faces is knowing the right moment to stop.  If it pushes things too far and it comes to another war, Argentina will probably lose again and its government would then have to fall on its sword.  Meanwhile Cameron will continue to ramp up the quarrel and stage silly and needless provocations because it helps distract public attention from things that are happening at home.In truth it would probably suit both governments if things could be left fairly much as they are now, with a war of words in full flow but no military conflict.

Phil Andrews ● 5187d

Leaving skinheads aside, I do remember the Falklands war, but that was in the days when we had a Navy and a fully manned Army and RAF. I'm sure you may be right about the cost of policing the Falklands, it must be astronomical, but what would we be if we just took a hike and left the people at the mercy of Argentina? This is the legacy of our history and we still owe a loyalty to those islanders. Thatcher just loved it and you are right she milked it for all she was worth to ensure a return to office, but leaving all that aside, the Argentinians may have the hump but they too have to recognise that the people who live in the Falklands have determined they want to stay British and that has to be respected. People like Penn who bang on about colonialism and empires are just being stupid and winding the situation up, we no longer have pretensions to being a big mover and shaker but I like to think that we still have the guts which have served us very well throughout our history and woe betide anyone who fogets it.

Vanessa Smith ● 5187d

Much as I can't stand actors or any celebrities using their status to express, via the media, their opinions on sensitive issues, I have mixed feelings about the whole Falkland Islands issue.Personally, I'm not comfortable with any talk about empires or colonies, to me such words belong in the dim and distant past.  Again, as I often say, such words raise this horrible image in my head of skinhead St. George waving chavs singing Rule Brittania, totally blind to how Britain's position amongst the world superpowers is not what it used to be.Geographically speaking, it is farcical that the Falklands are ours, it is the equivalent of the Isle of Man belonging to Argentina.  If I put myself in the shoes of an Argentinian I'm pretty sure I'd feel the same way as most Argentinians do, in the same way that if the Isle of Man belonged to the Argentinians I'd think it was 'wrong'.Given the fact most residents of the Falklands are British, of course they want the Islands to remain under British rule, but I don't think that in itself should be the all important factor.  For instance, I don't know the answer to this, but economically does ruling the Falklands actually benefit us ? - I doubt it, given their distance from the UK etc.Of course, there's no way we'll relinquish the Falklands primarily in my view because of what happened in 1982.  Whilst I was too young to understand at the time, I share the view of the cynics that the 1982 war was extremely 'useful' in ensuring the Conservatives won the general election the following year.Hmmm, perhaps my feelings on this whole issue aren't as mixed as I thought...

Adam Beamish ● 5187d

I have mixed feelings about this - I think some of the luvvie brigade on Question Time for example to give the sort of 'everyman' response rather than a political one. I'd rather like to see random members of the public on the panel for a change - don't suppose that'll ever happen. Perhaps they'd have David Giles from W4 on - that would start a lovely row - good viewing though!

Vanessa Smith ● 5187d

I find it bizarre that actors are taken at all seriously and seem invested with any type of legitimacy when it comes to commenting on anything.Not so long ago in history being an actor had the stigma of being a rogue and an untrustworthy vagabond,now they are on Question Time and other current affairs programmes telling us what for.There is a simple reason for this.They all have 'tame'opinions as the programmes they are on are owned by people who will give them work or show their films if they say the right things and don't get too controversial.The whole incesstuos media and celebrity luvvie darling rubbish made flesh.

Keith Iddon ● 5187d

I wonder what Argentina would say to holding a referendum for the residents on the Islands to decide the argument? Would they then shut up and go away?

Vanessa Smith ● 5187d

The Argies should think twice about invading again imo.We have 3000 soldiers there rather than the 300 we had last time and we have 4 Tornado jets there.A friend of mine who is in the Grenadier Guards did some training there a couple of years ago after one of his Afghan tours so the army are familiarising soldiers who are not there with what to expect if they are sent.No one wants to see any military action,but the situation has all the hallmarks of more aggro.

Keith Iddon ● 5187d

Leaving oil aside - how do you square that with the wishes of the Islanders that they would rather stay with the U.K.?

Vanessa Smith ● 5187d

True. And it's our oil! ;-)

Keith Iddon ● 5187d

"I seem to remember that 30 years ago the residents made it quite clear they want to be British, and if they change their minds I'm sure we'd clear off"I'd say 'wake up and smell the coffee', but 'wake up and smell the oil' would be much more appropriate.

Ian Fillingham ● 5187d

He should visit the Falklands and speak to the people as he has done in Argentina before saying anything,though why his opinion is more important anyone else's is a mystery.It has been a British colony since before Argentina was a country.

Keith Iddon ● 5188d

He spouts about giving people freedom etc but then ignores the fact that over 90% of the population of the Falklands want to remain British.

Neil Chippendale ● 5188d

You have to wonder why he suddenly starts spouting about something that is no business of his whatsoever and about which he clearly knows nothing. Shame, as I rather admire him as an actor.

Susan Kelly ● 5189d