Forum Topic

People in poorer parts of UK should be paid LESS:

Osborne's plan to end public sector national pay awards is shocking. This Tory/Lib Dem lot are quickly turning the country into an us an them society. The Lib Dems should be ashamed of themselves if they don't fight this and the 50p tax cut.Then again they should be ashamed of themselves for joining the Tories in the first place.

Neil Chippendale ● 5156d19 Comments

Is your nick-name 'Il Duce'?

Keith Iddon ● 5154d

Bad news the Tories will continue to ensure that the gap between the haves and the have nots will continue to grow. Good news the Liberals will be wiped from the face of the political map at the next election.When will people realise that they party (2) system of Government does not work and only a House full of independants is true democracy.On the other hand vote me in, I'll take away your vote, but I promise to make the trains run on time, and be affordable to ordinary people.

paul wilson ● 5154d

"The public elect their representatives because they want to see them in power.  For them to refuse to assume that power when the opportunity to take it arises would seem to defeat the object of the exercise."Not sure I can totally agree with this statement. Many people vote Lib Dem to prevent the Conservative party from coming to power in certain constituencies and I am sure that are many that will never vote for the party again following this deal with the devil

Claire Peleschka ● 5154d

I'd really be taken in by this IF the government had made the slightest effort to get the tax that has been avoided by Vodaphone and the rest instead of allowing the HMRC to do 'sweetheart deals' with them, thereby letting them off the hook. We are talking billions, so I really don't want to hear about 'unaffordable' pensions, again no one mentions the 'pension holidays' that employers took for donkeys years which then became a big black hole and then the whingeing about how all of a sudden pensions could not be afforded, even though employees had continued to pay in. It was and is an absolute disgrace yet somehow some smart spin has made it all the fault of ordinary working people usually in the public sector who were lucky enough not to be subjected to this double dealing.

Vanessa Smith ● 5155d

In perspective, apart from the division of overpaid bankers, management consultants, lawyers and TV presenters all of whom are grossly overpaid, most people in normal jobs have not had pay and salary increases for many years.In many industries, pay rises have not occurred to 15 years and for a great many 1 or 2% is the best they can expect.This is not is low paid dead end or unskilled jobs, this is the norm in highly skilled occupations as well.This in itself is not right as in almost every case apart from failing industries, huge salaries and dividends are still going to those in the right places at the top.The reality is that the taxes paid by people who are in industries where salaries have stayed still or diminished in real terms are funding rates of pay, and pensions for those in state run organisations. Who have enjoyed unsustainable pay increases and pensions for way too long and out of balance with the real world.It won't make a difference to anyone here in London, it's almost like a different nation to the rest of Britain. But the playing field needs to be levelled and if they want to do this by bringing down what are overpaid positions for the hours and work done, then they must at least address the huge rake off at the top end of private sector.

Michael Brandt ● 5155d

1) Some rich boys.2) Many big companies also paid final salary schemes and indeed some were better than those for the public sector.I prefer the mansion tax principle - but phased in and not for the over 60's. And no I don't live in a mansion.

George Knox ● 5155d

As a former civil servant I can tell you that salaries were less than the private sector because you had the promise of a decent pension - some hopes with this lot! London Weighting was absorbed into salaries years ago so has conveniently been forgotten. I thought the editorial in 'The Observer' really hit the nail on the head re the 50% rate of income tax - "The pressure is coming from the Tory right and a vocal, self-serving element in the business community. They want the top rate of income tax to be reduced from 50%. In that way, the government can demonstrate that it is on the side of enterprise. Neither will it cost much; the tax raises much less revenue than it should, it is argued, as those eligible change their behaviour, salting their income away in tax havens. But - if the tax is so ineffective at raising money, why is it such a discouragement to eneterprise?" Quite - the rich boys want it all ways - and if anyone seriously thinks that the people who are eligible to pay this top rate will ever change then they are either incredibly naive or just plain stupid.

Vanessa Smith ● 5155d

50% tax to be lowered, as I believe the argument that we need to encourage more high earners to pay their tax, rather than find ways to avoid it.We should over-punish those on high wages / salaries.Obviously this move, in my government, would be backed up with harsher penalties for those high earners evading tax and that goes for companies too.

Richard Smith ● 5155d

My feeling is that government officers used on average to be paid less than in the private sector. If I am correct, and that also the average government officer is now getting paid a bit more, then that tells me that the private sector is adjusting to international pressures by reducing salaries so as to try and remain competitive.That is a process which will last for many decades and I feel that is what has been happening particularly since the immigration floodgates were opened and since the financial crash.We used to be such a rich country, and we are so used to having grown up with that, that it is all the more painful to seeing adjustments being made. But no longer are we so rich, and there are such vast numbers now who call on the state for support. Someone was trying to convince us recently that there are not enough tax payers to go round to pay for the great organs of state providing the range of services which we crave.So we shall see step changes which are painful, and hitting the public servants is an adjustment of market salary forces. I feel sorry for them to an extent, but we all need to see that adjustments are vital.I get a little concerned about the 50% tax rate because for honest people who do pay their taxes it is a high tax and a disincentive. All tax payers who earn more than the standard rate have to do a tax return. I would change the law so that they get a small tax rate reduction if they pay 2.5% into a charity such as what was called the City Parochial Foundation, which is one of a number of charities which collect donations and then distribute to front line charities in the community. All the taxpayer would have to do is get a certificate from City Parochial and enclose it with the tax return, or probably there are electronic ways of doing this more cheaply.

George Knox ● 5155d

I'd like to run with Richards idea,BUT to make it fairer the Government should give everyone a bonus of say 10% of their income. That way people on a basic State Pension would get about £450 and people in the "new" 40% band would get a minimum of £3740 and up to £squillions.   Oh and I think guide dogs should have to pay fares on public transport.

Tony Wood ● 5155d

Addressed to Richard - 50% tax to be dumped - WHY?

Vanessa Smith ● 5155d

Why?

Vanessa Smith ● 5155d

For a government - especially the Tories, who have always banged on about the free market economy they've a strange way of practising that. Pay people less depending on where they live to make it easier for private sector companies to compete  - WTF? It just keeps people's earning capacity low and makes it easy for these employers to pay the minimum wage. Just the same as bailing out the banks in my book, what happened to competition??? It is outrageous that people doing the same job wherever they happen to live should not be paid the same rate, I agree that this should also be applied to MPs if it's such a spiffing wheeze. On top of that this barmy idea of privatising the roads - is Dodgy Dave really serious when he is comparing it to what they've done with the water companies? Well, that's been SUCH a success hasn't it? I foresee tolls etc. looming, let's bash the motorist yet again............... I really hope those 250 odd G.P.s carry out their threat to stand for election and target the Tory and LibDem seats, individuals have done this before and won - I see no reason why this should not be just as successful, good for them.

Vanessa Smith ● 5155d

In OZ the government gave everyone who earned less then a certain amout, can't remember how much, $1000. I used mine to buy UK pounds.

Neil Chippendale ● 5155d

I agree with cutting the 50% tax rate, but Osbourne needs to help the whole of society.Give every household in the UK £5,000 instead of the next round of qualatitive easing. £5,000 in local shopping vouchers that must be spent in the next 6 months.Not sure why we bailed out the banks from the public purse.We are still feeling the pinch, but the banks are just fine and not loaning any more (learning from their mistakes I suppose)

Richard Smith ● 5155d

Another way of reducing pensions as well?  :-(

Sarah Felstead ● 5155d

As well as London Weighting, when I worked in Local Government I was put on a lower grade outside of London for doing the same job. I assume this is still the case.JL.

Jim Linwood ● 5155d

I don't suppose they are including mp's from outside London included in this idea are they? Many people who work in public services in London get a London weighting allowance to reflect the fact that things are more expensive here so I would think that people in other areas already earn less.

Keith Iddon ● 5156d

I don't blame the Lib Dems for having gone into coalition (although maybe having been there myself I might be expected to say that).  The public elect their representatives because they want to see them in power.  For them to refuse to assume that power when the opportunity to take it arises would seem to defeat the object of the exercise.And the fact that, locally and nationally, even those on the progressive side of politics are more prepared to ally themselves with the Tories than with Labour speaks much more about the nature of Labour as a party than it does about themselves.But you are right, the Lib Dems need to stand up to this.  They cannot afford to be associated with some of the things the Tories are attempting to do if they are to retain any credibility amongst their natural constituency.  They need to draw a line in the sand, quickly, and publicly commit the Tories to not stepping over it.I can tell the Lib Dems that it will get worse the closer we get to the next general election.  Their partners will consider them more and more expendable.  They will not be thinking beyond 2015, and of the possibility that they may need to be thinking in terms of a coalition after that.Politicians appear to me to have memories that last a week, and they generally work on the assumption (sometimes admittedly with good reason) that everybody else does to.I don't think the Lib Dems would do well at an election right now whatever they decide to do.  But it would be a great tragedy for them if they were to allow the fear of short-term electoral hardship to hold them to ransom for the remainder of this Parliament.

Phil Andrews ● 5156d