Forum Topic

Isleworth Public Hall

Seems that Labour are determined to wash their hands of it considering the Forward Plan informs us that a report is due to be presented at Cabinet in September even before a report is due to be discussed at the local Isleworth and Brentford Area Forum for comments by local councillors a few days after!!This really stinks

Paul Fisher ● 4583d39 Comments

Yes, it is a pity that the ICG split the anti-Labour vote. Let's hope it won't happen again!@ David Giles - rather the Tories split the anti-Labour vote, still can't see more than a handful of right-wing fruitcakes voting Tory this time round.

Ian Speed ● 4557d

I think you're talking about the proposed development around the corner from this location - quite a few locals up in arms at the moment but I don't think it will affect The Public Hall.

Vanessa Smith ● 4559d

Rumour has it that some of the lower blocks of Council housing are to be replaced with fancy tower blocks facing the river, so maybe the hall is in the way.

Sarah Felstead ● 4560d

I'm sure David will give you his opinion once his party lets him know what it is.

Phil Andrews ● 4565d

David has gone quiet.

Steve Taylor ● 4565d

Couldn't have put it better myself Steve.

Andrew Sibley ● 4566d

DavidSo let me see whether I've got this right.  "Small numbers of community activists" under the leadership of the ICG can take Thames Water to Court to find them guilty of contravening the Environmental Protection Act, where the Conservatives failed miserably to uphold the ACT and protect the people it purported to serve whilst leading Hounslow Council, despite the evidence laid before them by community spirited activists, but if I want to get my local day care centre closed or a CPZ in my street that nobody wants I need to join your party?

Steve Taylor ● 4566d

DavidI was elected on three consecutive occasions in Isleworth - in 1998 (Isleworth South), 2002 and 2006.  I served as a councillor for twelve years, three of them as a member of what is now called the Cabinet.In 2010, under the very difficult circumstances created by the general election being held on the same day, I won the highest vote ever achieved by an independent candidate in a local election under the London Borough of Hounslow and failed to be elected by just 78 votes.I have nothing to prove to anybody.  Chiswick would provide me with a very interesting and fulfilling new challenge, and I believe that with a viable campaign I could produce a significant outcome.None of this of course would impact in any way upon the ability of my colleagues to contest Isleworth if that is what we decide to do.  We have all kinds of options at the moment and nothing has been ruled in or out.

Phil Andrews ● 4573d

If you are thinking of standing in Chiswick next time around you will of course be free to do so. But it will prove to all that you have given up any chance of being elected in Isleworth where you have lived and campaigned for many years.

David Giles ● 4574d

Quite possibly it won't David, after all I am considering standing in Chiswick this time around.

Phil Andrews ● 4574d

Yes, it is a pity that the ICG split the anti-Labour vote. Let's hope it won't happen again!

David Giles ● 4574d

Absolutely spot on Paul. Ultimately it is about residents and their willingness to fight. Isleworth residents are currently the ones who are prepared to stand up and be counted and they do this still regardless of the fact that they now have Labour councillors.This is precisely why Labour wants the ICG to contest Isleworth next year - they believe we will lose, become demoralised and disappear and the fighting spirit of the Isleworth people will be crushed.  Not a chance.Ironically Chiswick people are probably better placed to work for positive change than anybody, due to their spending power and the fact they have a livlier grapevine which more people are tuned into than is the case anywhere else in the borough.  The downside for me though is that the people are naturally more conservative (small "c" as well as large) and thus possibly a tad more inhibited.  However I do believe this instinctive reticence will disappear if the people are pushed far enough.As you rightly say political ties are not usually the defining factor when there is a burning issue at hand, but the caveat emptor is where there is a party line involved.  Forced to choose between the will of the party and the interests of the community there is a certain type of individual who will always opt for the former, and we see them at work on this forum representing both "camps".  Such people potentially constitute a fifth column in our midst and how much power they wield can impact upon the ability of a community to fight its corner successfully.As for councillors and MPs - they can be active, passive or hostile when it comes to supporting community campaigns.  I am biased of course, but I would suggest that community councillors are by their very nature active, and proactive.  From what I have seen of Conservative councillors they tend to range from the mildly supportive, through the indifferent to the downright confused.  Labour councillors, of course, are Labour councillors - the command of the machine is all-important and absolutely nothing else computes.The bottom line is that it is communities which bring about real positive change, and long may it remain so.  But having elected representatives who are on your side and who have the will and the wit to use their knowledge and influence to your maximum benefit is important too.

Phil Andrews ● 4574d

Phil These are my own thoughts based on being born in this borough and some community work.Back in the dark ages Chiswick always had  a community spirit and would pull together to fight what they though was wrong for this part of the borough. They have fought off a Gas works, Power Station, and combined with other areas to stop the western ring motorway from being built, although I couldn’t tell you who was in power at any particular time. It seems that local residents put away political ties to come together to fight a common cause.Other  projects in Chiswick around 2000 that had locals residents pulling together in a common cause had cross party support so you couldn’t say it was because the Labour or Conservative party were in power at the time.At the moment Isleworth residents still have the will to get out of there chairs and do something for themselves to make their voice herd  on a subject they feel strongly about rather than wait for a  for someone to lead them.Other areas of the borough are dived street by street, they will fight there own little corner but never seem to see the larger picture and help others fight there’s If you don’t stand up and fight for what is right your just going to be trodden on buy whatever party is in power, it's people power that counts at the end of the day

Paul Allen ● 4574d

PaulThank you for this gem.  As a student of history I find it fascinating.However this report must be more than twelve years old bearing in mind that Councillor Jo Langton, whose support is credited, passed away in early 2001.Is there anything that the local Conservatives have achieved this century that could be cited to add some weight to David's view that residents in Isleworth would be better served by Conservatives than by councillors whose first loyalty is to their own community rather than to a national political party?

Phil Andrews ● 4574d

"The Conservatives did not surrender power. Labour won it - partially because the anti-Labour vote was split in some wards. If we want to get Labour out of power in Hounslow, then the only way to do it is to elect a Conservative majority. Anything else helps Labour to cling on, however discredited it is."Well, what else is to be said David?  The ICG apologises unreservedly for fielding candidates in Isleworth and Syon wards and splitting your vote.

Phil Andrews ● 4574d

David Giles, the Chiswick resident who has been the moving force behind the campaign to save the Chiswick Pool, believes that sustained public pressure was crucial to the Council's final decision.In a statement, Mr Giles said: "Great credit is due to the people of Chiswick, to pool users and pool staff who united behind the campaign to keep Chiswick New Pool open as a public swimming pool open to all upon payment of affordable fees. There is no doubt in my mind that without the strength and mobilisation of public opinion, the Pool could have been sold off or shut by Hounslow Council."We are a particularly grateful for the steadfast support of our local councillors in Chiswick Riverside Ward, Paul Lynch, Robert Kinghorn and Jo Langton and to their colleagues in Turnham Green Ward, Adrian Lee, Peter Thompson and Samantha Davies. Veteran Chiswick Homefields Councillor Norah Atkins spoke up strongly for the Pool in November and her Homefields colleague Councillor Pat Sterne deserves credit for persuading her Labour colleagues to keep Chiswick New Pool open."When Frank Dobson expressed his support through his campaign manager, Ann Keen, I knew we had probably won the fight. A politician of Mr Dobson's stature and experience does not like to be associated with failures and Ann Keen has a well documented history of associating herself with popular causes."Conservative mayoral candidate Steve Norris and Liberal Democrat hopeful Susan Kramer went out of their way to associate themselves with support for the campaign some weeks ago and we are delighted that Frank Dobson has followed in the footsteps of his Labour colleagues, Ken Livingston and Glenda Jackson. We are also grateful for the support of Olympic gold medallists Duncan Goodhew and Daley Thompson, for the support of the Head Teachers and parents of our local primary schools and to the many thousands of people who signed petitions and wrote letters."Chiswick united, can never be defeated!""I would like to say a particular word of thanks to John Bingham, a Chiswick resident who organised a letter writing campaign to the Brentford, Chiswick and Isleworth Times."Let us hope that when we see the details, that this is a really good deal for Chiswick, pool users and pool staff. Right now we should all celebrate with a few pints of Fuller's London Pride and salute Chiswick's success with Chiswick's own excellent beer."

Paul Allen ● 4575d

Phil,You know full well that the Conservatives and the local community in Grove Park were successful in thwarting Hounslow Council's plans to impose large CPZ's in Grove Park.  Ed Mayne then unilaterally imposed a limited CPZ for a few hours a day in Park Road where his parents live and in part of Staveley Road against the wishes of local residents. I mentioned the Chiswick New Pool campaign because it was one I was deeply involved in personally. Since then there have been many campaigns and issues in Chiswick which have been successful and which have been supported or led by the Conservatives. If you lived in Chiswick, you would know that.Most importantly, the Conservatives succeeded in electing a Conservative MP for Brentford and Isleworth, who lives locally, and whom even her opponents agree is much more effective than her Labour predecessor Ann Keen.Yes, Labour won the 2010 Borough Election as it had won every Borough Election except the 2006 one. The Conservatives did not surrender power. Labour won it - partially because the anti-Labour vote was split in some wards. If we want to get Labour out of power in Hounslow, then the only way to do it is to elect a Conservative majority. Anything else helps Labour to cling on, however discredited it is.

David Giles ● 4575d

I wonder whether any of the good people who frequent W4.com are reading this thread and, if so, whether they would agree that the Conservatives have been successful in thwarting Ed Mayne and his CPZs?Out of interest, how long ago was the Chiswick Pool campaign?  Have the Conservatives achieved anything whatsoever in Hounslow since they surrendered office to Labour in 2010?

Phil Andrews ● 4575d

I want some of David Giles' mind bending drugs!!

Andrew Sibley ● 4575d

The Labour Party closed the Chiswick Day Card Centre despite the best efforts of community activists, doctors, churches  and the local Conservative MP and Councillors to oppose it.The major CPZ's proposed for Grove Park were stopped by local community activists supported by local Conservative Councillors.Council Tax increases were frozen and major savings in Council expenditure were made by the Conservative led administration fro 2006/ 2010.The closure of Chiswick New Pool was stopped by community activists supported by Conservative MP's and Councillors.I could list many instances whereby the Conservative Party has worked with the local community in Chiswick and elsewhere to achieve results local community activists could not have achieved on their own.

David Giles ● 4575d

The Labour Party closed the Chiswick Day Card Centre despite the best efforts of community activists, doctors, churches  and the local Conservative MP and Councillors to oppose it.The major CPZ's proposed for Grove Park were stopped by local community activists supported by local Conservative Councillors.Council Tax increases were frozen and major savings in Council expenditure were made by the Conservative led administration fro 2006/ 2010.The closure of Chiswick New Pool was stopped by community activists supported by Conservative MP's and Councillors.I could list many instances whereby the Conservative Party has worked with the local community in Chiswick and elsewhere to achieve results local community activists could not have achieved on their own.

David Giles ● 4575d

DavidSo let me see whether I've got this right.  "Small numbers of community activists" can keep libraries and community centres open, but if I want to get my local day care centre closed or a CPZ in my street that nobody wants I need to join your party?I think I have it now.

Phil Andrews ● 4575d

Phil,It is really very simple. The party that holds the majority of seats in the council or in parliament, has the power to make decisions. Small partied and independents can only have influence or power if they hold the balance of power and one or other of the major parties has to rely on them for support.A small number of community activists - and I am one myself when the occasion demands - like the proposed closure of Chiswick New Pool some  years ago-  can influence decisions on important single issues. But in order to pursue a wider agenda or programme, individuals need to join one of the two major political parties which in Hounslow are Labour and Conservative.I am not particularly concerned about the defection of some Councillors to UKIP. They were elected as Conservatives and they will be replaced by Conservatives at the next borough elections. UKIP has no coherent policies for local government and very few policies for national government either other than withdrawal from the EU and banning immigration.

David Giles ● 4575d

DavidLocal residents in Isleworth, with no council seats of their own, successfully campaigned to keep Isleworth Library and St. John's Community Centre open, and in the latter case to protect a financial commitment won for them by ICG councillors at the 2010 budget meeting which Labour councillors had subsequently given the appearance of wanting to default on.Local residents, without the support of either major political party, successfully sued Thames Water for compensation over the odour problems inflicted on the local community by the Mogden Sewage Treatment Works.By contrast the Conservatives - who began this term with 25 councillors, now have 20 and are shortly to lose more through further defections - failed in their campaign to keep the Chiswick Day Centre open and failed in their efforts to prevent the Grove Park CPZ from happening, which as everybody knows is the precursor to what will become a much larger CPZ.Indeed, if the Conservatives have actually achieved ANYTHING since they walked out of office in 2010, other than losing 20% of their membership of the Council, then please do avail yourself of this opportunity to tell us all about it.Isleworth residents have no reason to be confident that in the extremely unlikely event of a Conservative administration being elected facilities such as Isleworth Public Hall will be protected.  Under the previous administration St. John's featured on a list of properties "to be disposed of" and only the ICG's flat refusal to even countenance it prevented the idea from being progressed.As a rule of thumb Tories can be expected to close community centres to sell the land they are built on for development, just as Labour can to expected to close community centres because they cannot live with the idea that residents might wish to organise amongst themselves outside of the influence of their party.  Either way the community gets screwed.I am aware that you live your life in a two-party political bubble, but it would be helpful to those of us who don't if you could give us an intelligent explanation as to why you think Isleworth residents would be better served by electing Conservative councillors than by electing dedicated local activists from amongst their own ranks, and something more tangible than the usual mindless tribal chant would be especially appreciated.

Phil Andrews ● 4575d

After the shenanigans of the 'coalition' how could anyone vote for them?

Vanessa Smith ● 4575d

After all Labour screw-ups I don't know how can people vote for them.

Alex Shpinkov ● 4575d

All I can say is that if this government is an example I would rather slit my wrists than vote Tory - not now, not next year, not ever!

Vanessa Smith ● 4576d

How can local residents take control of the situation when the Hall is owned by Hounslow Council and not the local residents. Hounslow Labour Council treats ward councillors and local residents with contempt. You are tilting at windmills.In Chiswick Riverside, local residents, with the support of all nine Chiswick Conservative Councillors, successfully prevented the imposition of several CPZ's proposed by Hounslow Council. Isleworth Labour Councillor Ed Mayne then used his power as Lead Member to unilaterally impose a limited CPZ on Park Road and part of Staveley Road. We are not happy with that decision but it is a much better result than if we had a much larger CPZ.It is up to the electors of Isleworth to vote out Ed Mayne and his Labour colleagues at the next borough elections. And it is up to the electors of Hounslow to vote Labour out of power in the borough. And the Conservative Party is the only party with the candidates and organisation across the borough that can do this.

David Giles ● 4576d

DavidIt is time I won the lottery but that isn't going to happen either.  This is a serious discussion and Isleworth Public Hall is under immediate threat.  The problem needs to be dealt with urgently which means residents taking control of the situation.Let's face it, you guys couldn't even prevent an unwanted CPZ from being imposed in an area where you hold all the seats on the local Area Forum.  You're going to be a fat lot of help in Isleworth, aren't you?We don't have the time to indulge fantasies and play silly political games.  Isleworth residents need organised community action and that comes from within.  What on Earth has led you to believe that you have something we need?

Phil Andrews ● 4576d

Hounslow is a rotten borough under Labour.It is time to clear Labour out and elect a Conservative administration that can be trusted to run the borough efficiently, fairly and democratically in the interests of all local residents.

David Giles ● 4576d

Hounslow is a rotten borough under Labour.It is time to clear Labour out and elect a Conservative administration that can be trusted to run the borough efficiently, fairly and democratically in the interests of all local residents.

David Giles ● 4576d

It would help if the Council and I include both councillors and officers started to actually be honest with the stakeholders but I wont hold my breath

Paul Fisher ● 4576d

That's what we would all hope for - but people need to know the true financial position, keeping these buildings open is very important but the council and its contractors need to work with the Friends and other stakeholders to move forward in some degree of agreement. People aren't stupid they know how hard budgets have been affected - I fear that were the hall to be involved in a deal with the local Blue School it would curtail a lot of community activities. As you have pointed out local people paid for this building - it is highly regarded and much valued, they must not be fobbed off now.

Vanessa Smith ● 4576d

This is the building in South Street. Surely it can be saved for Community use?

Jim Lawes ● 4577d

In the beginning:

Jim Lawes ● 4577d

The words 'underhand' and 'Labour' seem to go hand in hand in Hounslow these days.

Andrew Sibley ● 4578d

Absolutely spot on Vanessa and exactly what I would have posted today from work except for some reason my postings wont go though from my desk PCI know that our local councillors toe the party line but come on grow some balls and fight on behalf od all of us who value this amazing building in Isleworth and help the people who work so hard to keep it a local community asset

Paul Fisher ● 4582d

I understand that the Friends of IPH are less than happy about what is going on and are in effect being left out of the loop. Cllr. Collins is to ask for an update at the IBAF meeting, but so far no consultation has been seen. The worry is that the hall will be handed over to the Blue School at some peppercorn rent which would be an absolutely disgraceful and underhand move. Along with the Green School who are also going off at a tangent about opening a Green School for Boys it seems the CoE are planning a takeover in Isleworth! Local people have an absolute right to be told what the council is up to and our councillors should be listening and acting on behalf them. We are all aware of the financial constraints that local authorities are working with, but for God's sake they should be upfront and stop this sneaky and disingenuous behaviour. A lot of people have put a lot of of effort into keeping the IPH going and improving it - they deserve better than this.

Vanessa Smith ● 4583d

With the period between now and that date being the holiday period, when residents are most likely to be away!Same old local Labour, indeed if anything this lot appear to have become even more underhand and cynical than their predecessors.  They really do seem to be throwing down the gauntlet now, don't they?

Phil Andrews ● 4583d